As a former government employee myself, I never needed to pay much heed to taxation for I was taxed at source and it was not necessary to submit tax forms at the end of each financial year. It was all done for me.
However, this year I have a couple of tax issues to address via HMRC. In this process I have discovered that on their system I am still listed as being employed by Rotherham Metropolitan Borough Council. HMRC sent me a letter about the matter last week. It was a big surprise as I was employed by Rotherham between January 1978 and August 31st 1980 and never since.
Last Friday morning I tried to phone HMRC about this but our wireless house phone ran out of charge after thirty minutes. I had been kept waiting all that time. This morning I tried again with a fully charged phone but again it ran out of charge so I tried our old wired house phone.
I sat there for fifty minutes until finally, finally I was put through to a human being in the north east of England. As I waited I listened to mind-numbing muzak and an intermittent recorded message: "Thanks for waiting. Your call is important to us. Please continue to hold. An adviser will answer your call as soon as possible". You have probably heard similar false claims yourself while waiting at the end of a call.
Earlier I had heard, "Please note, this call may be recorded for monitoring and training purposes". When I hear that I always think I should be warning them that I will be doing the same!
Anyway the adviser with the north eastern accent dealt with the matter as best he could before telling me that I would need to get in touch with Rotherham Council myself to request a P45 termination of employment certificate - from 44 years ago!
On the internet, Rotherham Council seem to be highly skilled in hiding contact details and building "chat" systems that do not address the questions you want to ask. However, I persevered and finally managed to get through to their Human Resources department where I spoke to a helpful young man who noted my request and promised it would be dealt with in the next few days. Truthfully, I would not put much money on that happening.
The time I have spent on the phone dealing with a matter that was not of my own making is time I will never be able to get back. "All of our advisers are very busy at the moment". Well employ and train some more then!
I have ranted about the same thing numerous times. they don't seem to be listening.
ReplyDeleteThey are certainly not listening when we phone them!
DeleteI never wait on line anymore. I look up the company and send an email. If I don't get a reply I send another and one to the company headquarters if I can find out their email address.
ReplyDeleteFinding e-mail addresses can prove very difficult. It is as if they do not really want us to communicate with them.
DeleteIt makes my blood boil. These organisations are in effect ,stealing our time because it's obviously not as important as theirs!
ReplyDeleteI find that i just don't have the mental fortitude these days. Sigh.
If you do not have the mental fortitude Christina, try gin!
Delete"Times they are a-changing". It is horrible to sit waiting for someone to speak to and now we must speak to our doctors also by phone. The good old days have gone ;) And I have just pulled myself out of being anonymous, that's a breakthrough!
ReplyDeleteI guess that there are some advantages in being "Anonymous" but surely we should not have anonymity imposed upon us.
DeleteI hate those un-help line calls. It is worse when, or if, someone finally answers and I find that I cannot hear them clearly. I try to explain about my disability but frequently they get impatient and cut me off.
ReplyDeleteIt is bad enough when one is not hard of hearing.
DeleteI would contact the Minister For Common Sense if I was you YP. I think it is situated next to the Ministry For Silly Walks. Failing that try electronic mail or even old fashioned snail mail.
ReplyDeleteI would use e-mail or snail mail but the addresses are very well-hidden.
DeleteIn part of my role when working I had to contact various councils, and their websites are hopeless when it comes to finding the correct department, they channel you to common request and anything else is lost off the edge of their site. It was always frustrating.
ReplyDeleteThey seem to build defences to reduce incoming communications.
DeleteIf you really want the limits of your mental health and patience tested, try and get in contact with the British Home Office. It's impossible. Kafkaesque doesn't cover it. Twice in the last sixteen years [and I have lived in England for most my adult life] I learnt - via a third party - that I, born and bred in an EU member country, have no right to live here. Quelle surprise. Thought it'd be cleared up in a jiffy. Nil response on phone or via letter. Six months later ... I am curtly informed that, yes, I have every right to live here. You don't say! Second time round (under Theresa May as Home Secretary) I was deemed TURKISH with no right to live here DESPITE the fact that they had my passport in front of them. Phone calls/letters not answered. Nothing, nada, zilch. Six months later ... In the meantime I lived a legal nightmare, my life put on hold.
ReplyDeleteA sitting duck has nothing on me. Next stop? Rwanda.
U
I would have ignored it. They cannot go back 45 years.
ReplyDeleteI wish I could ignore it but apparently I am not allowed to. Without that P45 my new tax calculation will not happen. Utterly ridiculous.
DeleteThinking further, this does not make sense. You must have a more up to date tax record somewhere, linked to your teaching career, teachers pension and state pension. Have you looked on the Government Gateways?
DeleteThere is also the issue of how much is involved, and who owes who. Could be, it's not worth bothering.
I know for sure that none of it makes sense. It is all a waste of my time. Rotherham MBC have just e-mailed me back to tell me that that they have no record of my employment in their archives and that I should try contacting the school itself for that P45. If the school responds I know for sure what they will say and so I will be back on the phone to HMRC for 45 minutes or more.
DeleteMy understanding is that tax records only have to be kept for 7 years. The employer I was with all that time ago no longer exists. The chap at HMRC does not know what he is doing. If you phone again you'll get another idiot.
DeleteAs I say, there must be a more up-to-date record for you on Government Gateway.
If it's a large sum involved, e.g. from your rogue rental income, it is probably worth paying an accountant ~£200 to sort it out.
Maybe tax records only have to be kept for seven years but here we are talking about a P45... "Computer says NO!" I just have to go through the process even though I know that it will not bear fruit. Thanks for thinking about my predicament.
DeleteBureaucracies seem to exist, just to prop themselves up at times, not to serve others. It's maddening. I especially hate being told that my call is important, while I wait on hold forever.
ReplyDeleteIf they were honest the recorded message would say, ""You must be a mug for waiting. Your call is exceedingly unimportant to us. Please continue get very irate by holding. An adviser might answer your call as soon as they have had their lunch and enjoyed some downtime on their smartphone".
DeleteCustomer service has disappeared. Rational thinking has gone away, wouldn't it be reasonable that if you have not received income from the council in over 40 years, that you don't work there any longer? This is a "the rules are the rules" no judgement allowed decision, that if the form is not in the system, it has to be located, from 44 years ago.
ReplyDeleteIt's like being in a maze.
DeleteDealing with some of the things regarding my dad, his estate, and bills and such, I have spent far too much time on the phone, and on hold and listening to:
ReplyDelete"Thanks for waiting. Your call is important to us. Please continue to hold. An adviser will answer your call as soon as possible".
I have come to loathe that phrase.
I wish I could charge them for all the wasted time - say $20 an hour.
DeleteThe frustrations and trials of modern life were certainly never foreseen by our ancestors. Or even us.
ReplyDeleteThere was a time when phones were answered by humans without much delay.
DeleteIn some perverse way, I'm happy to learn that such systems aren't only here in America. I have a wired speaker phone next to my computer for such things so I can surf away until a human answers the phone.
ReplyDeleteI am glad I have made you happy in a perverse way Ed!
DeleteSo it isn't just in the USA that this stuff happens. Saying that it is frustrating is putting it mildly!
ReplyDeleteModern life!
DeleteI would hate to have the job of the person who has to answer.
ReplyDeleteThe person who answers is never blameworthy. It is the system's fault.
DeleteOh, Good Lord! I love stories about bureaucracy because they're always dryly amusing, but being stuck on hold that long couldn't have been fun.
ReplyDeleteNo! It was not FUN!
DeleteWhile I don't think I've had reason to phone our equivalent of the HMRC (at least not recently), I have experienced similar situations with other institutions. Sometimes one is offered the option that they will call back instead. That still usually involves waiting around by the phone with no idea when to expect that call, though. (But at least the phone is less likely to run out of charge...)
ReplyDeleteSometimes "they" offer a call back service but fail to call back. Then you return to square one.
DeleteYep. I do understand your frustration!
Delete